Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinta
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Dragon
I'm pretty sure i'm done with watching the Anime.
Whoever is directing it seems to have a pretty bid grudge for pacing, because it has effectively been killed.
Edit: I wonder if the anime would be better if i wait until it finished and watch it in the order from the novel.
While I share your complaints, I think those negative qualities should deter non-readers than readers. They are the ones suffering from it, while as a reader, I can just enjoy the animated and voiced version of the story I originally liked anyway.
I'll definitely rewatch this in the order i like when the whole thing is done. I just feel like there's no point to follow it on a weekly basis right now.
I just find it sad that SAO is being torn apart in GW because of the hype. Yes, I love it, but it is still a harem, shounen story. It isn't a masterpiece with unforeseeable twists and completely unconventional development, but it is great for what it is.
Even my favorite arc GGO isn't that complex of a story, and a lot of interesting aspects are left unexplored. However, it had really cool action and interesting new rules, so I love it.
It is evident that the SAO anime is being judged using a completely different standard compared to other shows. Negative aspects that are tolerated in other shows currently airing are being crucified in the SAO forum, and the really good parts are glossed over or ignored even if similar traits are highly praised in other shows.
It's always the case when something is extremely popular and is deemed "over-hyped" by the people who doesn't like it.
The anime is definitely pretty mediocre so far just judging from only the contents showed, but it really doesn't deserve all the hate it's getting. I just feels like some people in that thread are determined to hate the show just because there are some novel readers who are ready and willing to defend it. It's just one of those things that is best left alone.
Maybe the SAO anime is just a victim of the overwhelming popularity of the novels.
That is why I quit way ahead of all the other novel readers. I have experienced this type of bashing on a lot of popular adaptations because I tend to read the source material (VN, LN, manga, etc.) before watching the show, but never have I seen more nitpicking and ridiculous evaluations/interpretations than in the SAO thread.
I think people tend to over read into the anime, and I find it really funny. Some things should just be taken at face value (i.e. Kirito's explanations, feelings). It's like seeing people try to derive the meaning of ethics and morality from pokemon.
The Sword Art Online novels are sub-forum post level writing. I dropped the first one after being totally unable to get through the prose. Also, it's ridiculous for you to come posting shit like this in the novel thread just because you've got some kind of crazy misplaced elitism from reading a "novel" written for an internet contest.
Please be satisfied messing with only 1 thread.
I do agree that SAO writing is not stellar, like I said in my previous posts. It is what it is, and people just seem to hold it to some higher standard because of the hype.
It's great that you appreciate this show and the book, I can definitely understand being a fan. As I said after the first episode, it has a certain pleasant charm and the animation and art are, if a bit bland stylistically, certainly more than servicable. But it's a very flawed work and the protagonist as portrayed is an absolutely dreadful character. Characterizing my criticism of the show as just "messing" with a thread is extremely misleading and inaccurate.Quote:
Originally Posted by shinta|hikari
I absolutely disagree with your analysis on the character of the protagonist for reasons already mentioned by others in the other thread. I saw your arguments as simply messing around, but if you weren't, I take it back.
Moving on.
Similarly, as already mentioned in the previous thread, your view on the anime portrayal of the character is informed by the internal narrative present in the book. The book Kirito is more plainly a Mary Sue style shounen hero. Without that internal narration, the show Kirito is a much different person. You can't just assume all the narration from the book shapes the character in the show as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by shinta|hikari
Buff seems to get it just fine even without the internal narration. Let's agree to disagree.
Why is the Alicization Running novel taking so long to get translated? Are they going to release it in one go?
Just because a character's internal narration isn't shown doesn't mean he is a totally different character. Instead, it just means you don't see his thoughts. I guess you can make up reasons for his behavior that aren't true to his character and act like they're true, but it seems like the only reason to do that is to annoy people who know the real character. Nobody cares if people speculate about his character, but to say he's a selfish, heartless bastard because he did X and not considering other reasons why he did X is just pointless.
This is a tremendously stupid and reductionist way to read things. Omitting the narration is an element of the show, and not having the protagonist spew hackneyed garbage about how he's going to be the one to save the world does make him a different (and not necessarily a lesser) character. Compare this to Kubrick eliminating the final chapter of A Clockwork Orange when he adapted it - you don't just assume that the omitted material happened anyway, omitting it made the character different.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterOfMoogles
"Getting it" isn't the deal here, bucko. We're not wrong because he acted or thought differently in the book, or even because you could interpret the character in a different light in the show. Hope this helps.Quote:
Originally Posted by shinta|hikari
"Getting it" is the deal here. You say he is a different character in the show, but Buff, who is not a novel reader, interprets him just like the character in the novels. Your argument that novel readers are only seeing Kirito differently from you because they have extra knowledge does not stand.
You have a different opinion of Kirito from what you have seen in the anime, and I respect that. You just have to realize that Kirito can in fact be seen as a nice guy who helps people out even without novel knowledge. That is what I meant when I said "Let's agree to disagree."
Please refrain from name calling in your posts.
Just because one person has an interpretation that matches your own doesn't automatically make all other interpretations that you disagree with false.
With the novels, there is only one interpretation about Kirito's motivations because you are actually told directly what they are via first party account. That information is missing from the anime. Thus, both interpretations are valid there because Kirito has practically been a silent protagonist. Due to his actions in early episodes, the audience can't even be sure he's isn't lying to other people.
I have to wonder if we even read the same novel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Y
Since he acts the exact same as in the book and you don't see his thoughts in the anime, I don't understand why you keep saying that he's a different character. He's only different if you make up motivations and thoughts for him that are different from the book. Everyone is free to do that, but you can't act like the ones you've created have any kind of priority over others.Quote:
Originally Posted by Y
Exactly. What I don't understand is why when someone says "Kirito could actually be a nice guy because maybe he's doing this and this because of that" it is okay to say "No, that's wrong."Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryllharu
Is it really not fair to throw out the other side of the argument when everyone is suggesting Kirito is a deranged psychopath?
That's correct, and exactly what Shinta said:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryllharu
On the other hand, what shinta addressed was:Quote:
Originally Posted by shinta
I would infer that he is referring to a comment Y (supposedly) made saying that only LN readers could see Kirito as a nice guy (I think I recall him saying it in a more passive manner, such as "(Kirito being a nice guy) can only be seen that way if you had prior knowledge from the novels".Quote:
Originally Posted by shinta
In any case, going with the above information it would seem to me that Y is the one making absolute statements.
edit: I googled "bucko" and the results seem to range in how offensive the word is. Seems like another use of the word "buddy" or something.. but hey, it can be interpreted offensively, so if taken as such I'd say it's best to stop.
Except as I watch the anime, I can't see Kirito as anything but a sociopath, or at the very least antisocial to the point of basically being deranged.
My point isn't that one or the other is correct over the other. The issue is that those who have read the novel are "tainted" (for lack of a better word) and can't seem to accept the existence of the other viewpoint. Their opinions have been set by the narration of the novel, Kirito's direct discussion of his motivations and reactions, which simply doesn't exist in the anime at all as part of the narrative.
It's not even that the novel readers can't accept your view points. I myself have stated multiple times that there are many problems with this adaptation. I can see how someone would have a problem with Kirito's character.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryllharu
What i don't get it the absurd amount of bashing and trashing going on in the anime thread. There are many generic element that exist in a fantasy series and any long time anime watcher would be familiar with it. These same elements are often readily forgiven in another less popular anime, but with SAO every small problem is magnified and made out to be a big deal.
There's also trolls like Y.
He claims that he's not messing around, yet almost every response to something he doesn't agree with usually involves an insult. He start arguments by intentionally saying derogatory things in order to provoke a response. Then he would neg rep every person that disagree with him and state that he did it just because some anonymous neg rep him. For good measure, it seems like he needs to jump into this thread and pull it into a pile of horseshit too because there isn't already enough conflict in the anime thread.
That's all i really have to say about Y. I refuse to waste anymore time with his garbage so i'm ignoring his posts and will just hope for the best.
I also suggest for a mod to move this argument back into an anime thread or separate it into a GD thread. At this rate, it's just bait for anime only watcher to get spoiled.