Episode 32 Discussion "spoilers"

[Raquelcasull]

Destiny has been bothering me for a while now. Being the first true sequel to a Gundam series that I've seen so far, I was skeptical yet excited about Kira's return. 60% of the series has already been released, and there are so many loose ends that need to be tied up, created in the confusion known as "the first 25 episodes". I will save those questions for another forum discussion, back to my main concern.

In Destiny, Kira and his crew are portrayed as a misplaced bothersome force (like in SEED, but not quite the same feeling, you know what I mean, right?) He's already struck twice killing Shinn's family and love (Stellar). As the new main character, Shinn is too angsty for my blood >_<. He is definitely a love-hate character, and his skills are on par with Kira's (if not better). Assuming everyone has seen SEED before Destiny, am I the only one who is annoyed with the way Kira is portrayed? Why do I get the feeling Kira might die in this series? I'd hate myself for ever watching Destiny at that moment should my dear Kira perish to this super-angsty Shinn (btw I cheered when Athrun slapped him for the first time....and then again!).

I finally came to the conclusion that this is how (the writers) want Kira to atone for his sins from SEED. What are your opinions on how Destiny is carrying along? Please respond! Thank you!

*Also kudos to Kira for ending Stellar! I've been waiting for this moment ever since she killed Heine and his "Epyon" in a much short-lived and short-changed episode*

/salute Heine!
I miss you and wish you lasted much longer than that ; ;

[Mut]

That was an excellent episode.

Shinn is a douche.

[thejamppa]

Ok, when Stellar is out this phase, Mwu's clone captured and last Enchanted is dead... I think battle will now transfer in space and we will start solving Dullundal's real motives and agenda's. I guess we will see Lacus too. I'm bit disapointed that Stellar died but considering fact that Lunamaria has fallen for Shinn, there is two alternatives: Either Shinn dies at end of series or Shinn will make atonment somehow and will fall for Lunamaria...

But there is now question about it, Stellar is dead...

[cybercoin]

Shinn will kill Kira....or die trying.

Kira took everything away from him. His parents, sister and now Stellar aswell.

[thejamppa]

I doubt Shinn can kill Kira. Kira has Ahtrun as Friend, Cagalli as Sister and Lacus as Loved one. Taking out kira would collapse who series put relations in chaos. Besdies it wasn't Kira who killed Stellar. If Shinn will hold someone responsible it will him and Neo. He trusted Neo and Neo gave her word to keep Stellar safe, he broke it. Shinn also attacked Stellar. So no way, I don't really see change that Shinn would kill Kira. He might bear grudge against Kira or I think this is perfect way to mature up Shinn and make him real hero instead that whining little, arrogant brat that he has been.

Even Kira fought in Orb battle I don't really recall that Shinn saw Freedom there. Only Murasame's. Shinn if I'm right at that time Freedom and Justice were closer Murasame research facility to cover mass launcher... If anyone Shinn blaims his family's death, it will not be Kira but Cagalli, because she is Athha. Daughter of Orb's leader, who'se principles made EA to attack Orb and forced Orb forces defend Orb...

[Aeon]

Kira is now the worst Gundam character ever.

[danholo]

It wasn't Kira who killed Stellar? Did you even watch the episode? Maybe it wasn't his fault but he sure did kill Stellar in order to protect others, Shinn especially. While Shinn's ideals do coincide with Kira's, he really has a wierd and immature outlook on things. He'll grow up and shape the destiny of things. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

p.s. Nice to see somebody from Finland that watches Gundam. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[naruto22]

Originally posted by: danholo
It wasn't Kira who killed Stellar? Did you even watch the episode? Maybe it wasn't his fault but he sure did kill Stellar in order to protect others, Shinn especially. While Shinn's ideals do coincide with Kira's, he really has a wierd and immature outlook on things. He'll grow up and shape the destiny of things. [img][/img]

p.s. Nice to see somebody from Finland that watches Gundam. [img][/img]

OK, now that I think of it, maybe it was Kira who accidentally killed Shinn's family.

But please, since when did Shinn's ideals coincide with Kira's? Kira is a pacifict, Shinn is an aggressor. Shinn's style is very like a berserker with little thought of defence while Kira hasn't killed anyone since Gundam Seed Phase 50. Well, not directly anyway. Shinn's simply does not believe that peace is possible with the Earth Alliance which is why he joined ZAFT while Kira is constantly looking for a way to get both sides to look for peace. Kira, in spite of all he has seen, still has hope, while Shinn has none.

To be perfectly fair, Shinn may well be right. But to lose the will to change the way things are is not right. Abraham Lincoln made the South change what was truly an evil practice of slavery even though the South did not think it was. Just because the majority thinks its OK to do that, doesn't mean we all have to conform with it. That is why there have been rebellions that have overthrown tyrants throughout history. Every dynasty in China fell because of evil and corrupt emperors and officials. It was up to heroes to change the way things are.

I don't think its fair to say Stellar cannot be developed. Any character can be developed, and Stellar's development into something other than a war machine could have been fascinating. Not to mention take Shinn's mind of warmongering. That fellow hasn't had a family for a long time and could have used Stellar as a means of replacing the brotherly love he had for his sister at least.

Funny. Few episodes ago, I was also clamouring for Shinn's death and utter humiliation. But I realise his character is more to be pitied rather than spited. He actually is a good kid who does have a heart as he demonstrated several times when he saved the people of the pacific island and also in the desert. But he fails to see the big picture or view the EA soldiers as human beings, with women and children of their own. He talks about his sense of morality but fails to demonstrate it to his enemies as well.

I've got another prediction. Seing that Destroy is, well destroyed, maybe it'll be a duel to the death between Kira and Shinn that eventually destroys Freedom and Impulse. Afterwards, maybe it'll be healing time for Shinn. Heck, maybe he'll be brought on Archangel. But that would really make Destuny even more like a rehash of Gundam Seed so I guess it won't happen.

One thing we all like to see in the end: THE HUNT FOR LORD JIBRIL!!!!! By the Gods, I hope that that ass finally shows himself in the Girty Lue and finally Archangel and Minerva have a worthy target. And Kira can finally finds someone he can kill with no remorse. That guy is one of the most evil person I've ever seen. Anyone who can watch the slaughter of cities with glee deserves a slow roasting death underneath Freedom's lightsaber. To keep on killing others just because they think Coordinators are OK... that stinks of Fascism. Heck, even his colleagues were afraid of the huge degree of damage Destroy could dish out.

Hell, at least Azrael got his hands dirty by participating in the battles. That guy is still in his room stroking his damn cat.

[danholo]

Originally posted by: naruto22OK, now that I think of it, maybe it was Kira who accidentally killed Shinn's family.

First they made us think it was Freedom, then Calamity. Who knows?

But please, since when did Shinn's ideals coincide with Kira's? Kira is a pacifict, Shinn is an aggressor. Shinn's style is very like a berserker with little thought of defence while Kira hasn't killed anyone since Gundam Seed Phase 50. Well, not directly anyway. Shinn's simply does not believe that peace is possible with the Earth Alliance which is why he joined ZAFT while Kira is constantly looking for a way to get both sides to look for peace. Kira, in spite of all he has seen, still has hope, while Shinn has none.

Kira a pacifist? You have got to be kidding me. If he'd be a pacifist, he'd be the last person to pilot the Freedom. He understands the use of force but he doesn't want people to get killed.

The thing I'm trying to coincide here is that both believe that they must protect the innocent. Kira wants to protect everybody but Shinn has his ideas a bit mixed up and clearly has made up his mind on "who the bad guy is". Kira knows that there are some whackos but people are kind at heart. I guess Shinn'll understand this some day - or then he'll go all Anakin on us.

[naruto22]

Maybe pacificst is too strong a word, but regardless, Kira always holds back his punches. He understand the great power he wields when he pilots Freedom and so he is always extra careful with it. Shinn never does and delights in using his power to destroy his enemies.

Guys, just give the Murasame pilots their credit. Actually, we should thank the Archangel crew for arriving because ORB would have smashed the Minerva if not for their interference. The power maneuverability of the Murasame was showcased today against Chaos, which supports the fact that aerodynamic designs is better in atmosphere, and that's why Murasames did well. They were fast, maneuverable and at the same time, could become a mobile suit.

Besides, Chaos transformed mode doesn't like aerodynamic at all, therefore probably can't match the speed of the Murasame. Its transformed mode reminds me of robotech fighters when they transform halfway, with the hands and legs sticking out but the cockpit still there.

Teamwork people, teamwork. Sting was right in the sense that it isn't the mobile suit that determines the battle, its the pilot. But teamwork always outsmarts one opponent, especially if the opponent is an arrogant ass who underestimated the Murasame because they were Natural operated.

Mwu La Fraga piloted Strike well after they redesigned the OS, its just he had the bad luck of matching against Crueze first with a GUAIZ, which is a significantly upgraded version of the CGUE (white colour fancy version of a Ginn for those who can't remember) with beam technology and saber claws. And what does he face next.... PROVIDENCE!!!!! The guy was just plain unlucky: he didn't have a chance to fight fair and square against a Coordinator so we have no way of knowing how Fraga really does in a Mobile suit.

Assuming Neo is Fraga though, he did fight well against Kira with a Windam before Kira finally shot him down.


By the way, Archangel didn't barge into anyone's fight this time. Archangel was merely responding to distress calls and answered. Somebody had to stop Destroy, and Minerva wasn't close enough at the time. And Cagalli made good use of herself to protect civilians while the murasame took care of Chaos.

Damn it, I can't help getting enough of the Murasames. They deserve the win, that's all I can say.

Shinn, so much for losing your virginity. May you die with it intact.... joking guys. Kira would have fared better if he kept his intact instead of being seduced by that #!$*#@!%@#%)$&!^()$& Flay Alster.

By the way, do you all find some similarities between Flay and Shinn? Both utterly set in their ways, stubborn to positive encouragement, aiming to exterminate the enemy, think they are right and everybody else wrong.... OK, so maybe their different and I'm stretching a bit. But one thing is for certain.....

90-100% OF US HATE THEM!!!!

Oh well, we will see what they have in store for Shinn soon.

I really pitied Stellar. Imagine the fear Neo instilled in her of the unknown which caused her to cause so much death and destruction. On the one hand, we condemn her for the the huge amount of destruction, yet as we see her in the cockpit, she's simply a child who has been put at the helm of a city destroyer. Who has been taught that everyone else is a monster and that she must kill to protect herself from death. Even as she blasted the city, I couldn't really hate her after seeing her fearful face, constantly afraid and insecure. Why do you think Neo had to be near? To control her from going berserk, which she finally did after seeing Neo downed by Freedom. Oh no you don't, don't you all dare blame Kira for causing Stellar to go berserk. It was Neo who prepared her that way and now the city pays the price for Stellar's indocrination and brainwashing.

Its truly different from seeing a cool calculated mind like Crueze for example behind Destroy. Hating Crueze who kills for the fun of it and for his perverse view of humanity isn't difficult. but how can you hate a child that was simply given a big gun and told to shoot people or the Big Bad Wolf will get them?

In this sense, I give Destiny its credit and orginality from Gundam Seed. But I really wish they had'nt killed Stellar.

If there is anyone to hate, it is Lord Jibril and his organisation who created the Extended in the first place. Genetically creating human weapons while condemning Coordinators is the height of hypocrisy. And now we see the victim through Stellar, a simple minded child who just so happens to have been taught to kill since young.
May he die a slow death,

[Mut]

Curium, don't be a douche and idle only in Cellphones^2 channel. If you're gonna be on IRC, come to #gotwoot on irc.gotwoot.net

[telemari]

great episode. except for that flashbacks - maybe anime directors don't belive that someone can actually remember something 32 episodes ago. but freedom sure is a SCARY THING.

[Terracosmo]

It would be funny if Shinn killed Kira. Just to see the reaction of everybody.

[Mite Gai]

Shinn is the only one left now who can blow Freedom up so its likely Kira will at least get his ass beat by Shinn.

[XwingRob]

I still don't get why some people think Shinn is gonna go after Kira because his family got caught in the crossfire. I mean I suppose he was probaly angry at Freedom during the shock, but once he sat down and thought about it, he came to the conclusion that it was it Attha's fault. Which I do agree, Shinn and his family should not have been on that island when EA attacked. (Didn't they have two days before the EA finally attacked?)

[Curium]

Originally posted by: XwingRob
I still don't get why some people think Shinn is gonna go after Kira because his family got caught in the crossfire. I mean I suppose he was probaly angry at Freedom during the shock, but once he sat down and thought about it, he came to the conclusion that it was it Attha's fault. Which I do agree, Shinn and his family should not have been on that island when EA attacked. (Didn't they have two days before the EA finally attacked?)

Shinn doesn't strike me as the type that has ever thought about anything.

[XwingRob]

Originally posted by: Curium

Originally posted by: XwingRob
I still don't get why some people think Shinn is gonna go after Kira because his family got caught in the crossfire. I mean I suppose he was probaly angry at Freedom during the shock, but once he sat down and thought about it, he came to the conclusion that it was it Attha's fault. Which I do agree, Shinn and his family should not have been on that island when EA attacked. (Didn't they have two days before the EA finally attacked?)

Shinn doesn't strike me as the type that has ever thought about anything.

True, but he must have come up with something after a year's time... heh.

[chitgoks]

i dont even think shinn is better than athrun. it would be nice if it will be athrun vs shinn theny shinn will be embarassed by athrun once he owns him.. that will put a BIG dent in his ego

[Mut]

Shinn skips the thinking process and jumps to his emotional reactions.

[darkshadow]

well i kinda got some more respect for kira in this ep, cause het didnt seem "allpowerfull", and his jedi moves were cool............but still he need to die XD


and for ptx ( the i-hate-wings-on-gundams-guy)
you could cleary c in this ep freedom uses his wings for extended mobility, at that part where chaos and windam close in on him, he repositions the wings