Soon in anime itachi will appear

[Death BOO Z]

There's one thing that annoyes me with Kisame- we all know he won't be a badass.

there's no going around that, as much as I like to think of him as Zabuza #2 (Zabuza is one of the best anime villans, me thinks), it seems that he's just a stupid goon who followes Itachi and won't stand a chance against any 'half cool' jounin, he falls into the class of arrogant muscular buffons, like most of Inuyasha's 3 episode enemies, or the guy from Kenshin's first episode.. all brawns and no brains...

it's a really annoying trait of animes, pretty boys are allways stronger than strong looking guys, think about it, the guy with the thin curved sword and the long hair will allways beat the heavy wheight champion which uses a broad sword...

and not only that, Kisame has yet to speak one word of 'intelect' yet, all he said was how much his sword is great and how awsome he is, and when a bad guy speaks like that, we know he's just bark and no bite.

Too bad, Kisame could have taken a good spot in the badass list, now he's just Itachi's side kick... destined to be beaten by the likes of Sakura and the girl team..


Edit: I know that Berserk isn't like this, but it's an exceptional, so mighty and great as the manga\anime is, it's not part of the discussion.

[Daniel of Lorien]

Originally posted by: Death BOO Z
There's one thing that annoyes me with Kisame- we all know he won't be a badass.

there's no going around that, as much as I like to think of him as Zabuza #2 (Zabuza is one of the best anime villans, me thinks), it seems that he's just a stupid goon who followes Itachi and won't stand a chance against any 'half cool' jounin, he falls into the class of arrogant muscular buffons, like most of Inuyasha's 3 episode enemies, or the guy from Kenshin's first episode.. all brawns and no brains...

it's a really annoying trait of animes, pretty boys are allways stronger than strong looking guys, think about it, the guy with the thin curved sword and the long hair will allways beat the heavy wheight champion which uses a broad sword...

and not only that, Kisame has yet to speak one word of 'intelect' yet, all he said was how much his sword is great and how awsome he is, and when a bad guy speaks like that, we know he's just bark and no bite.

Too bad, Kisame could have taken a good spot in the badass list, now he's just Itachi's side kick... destined to be beaten by the likes of Sakura and the girl team..

Obviously you're not a Berserk fan... Gatts wields a 6foot sword and nothing can beat him... he is in no way bishi and he hates homos... he's like something you'd read in an american comic

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Daniel of Lorien
Obviously you're not a Berserk fan... Gatts wields a 6foot sword and nothing can beat him... he is in no way bishi and he hates homos... he's like something you'd read in an american comic

exactly what i was gonna say.

kisame is bad ass i think, but not like itachi bad ass. he has to be stronger than zabuza cuz there is no point of introducing someone who is so similiar yet, weaker.

[lasaire]

Well, even if Kisame doesn't have the range of jutsus or chakra potential of Itachi, that huge sword of his sucks chakra. That alone could make him very very difficult to fight. Not unbeatable, but difficult.

What's scary about Itachi is his mystery. Nobody has any idea what his real motives are, and unlike Orochimaru and Kisame, who very obviously enjoy mayhem and murder, Itachi is much more subtle. He's not too proud to retreat when the ultimate goal is unachievable. That makes for someone MUCH more dangerous in the long run. SOmebody like Orochimaru or Kisame will get into fights just for the hell of it, and arrogance can certainly be deadly. Itachi, however, has more cunning than arrogance, which makes for a much scarier badass.

[hiten mitsurugi]

Originally posted by: lasaire
What's scary about Itachi is his mystery. Nobody has any idea what his real motives are, and unlike Orochimaru and Kisame, who very obviously enjoy mayhem and murder, Itachi is much more subtle. He's not too proud to retreat when the ultimate goal is unachievable. That makes for someone MUCH more dangerous in the long run. SOmebody like Orochimaru or Kisame will get into fights just for the hell of it, and arrogance can certainly be deadly. Itachi, however, has more cunning than arrogance, which makes for a much scarier badass.

That isn't true at all. The ultimate scary badass, is someone who is strong enough to rape, murder, and pillage at sheer will. Why hide when you have nothing to hide from because you're indeed the strongest. The fact that Itachi retreats means that he is conscious of his existence, therefore he is afraid to die. Someone who is afraid to die becomes weak. If you don't take chances because you are afraid of your own mortality, then you can never become the strongest. You just become a person who does what they can to survive. There is nothing scary or badass about that.

There is nothing scary about Itachi's mystery. I think you really meant "appealing," like in "What's appealing about Itachi is his mystery."

[Mut]

Originally posted by: hiten mitsurugi
The fact that Itachi retreats means that he is conscious of his existence, therefore he is afraid to die. Someone who is afraid to die becomes weak. If you don't take chances because you are afraid of your own mortality, then you can never become the strongest. You just become a person who does what they can to survive. There is nothing scary or badass about that.

itachi didn't run away cuz he was afraid of dying, he did it cuz there was no rush to capture naruto. k thx.

[Uberbaka]

Originally posted by: hiten mitsurugi

Originally posted by: lasaire
What's scary about Itachi is his mystery. Nobody has any idea what his real motives are, and unlike Orochimaru and Kisame, who very obviously enjoy mayhem and murder, Itachi is much more subtle. He's not too proud to retreat when the ultimate goal is unachievable. That makes for someone MUCH more dangerous in the long run. SOmebody like Orochimaru or Kisame will get into fights just for the hell of it, and arrogance can certainly be deadly. Itachi, however, has more cunning than arrogance, which makes for a much scarier badass.

That isn't true at all. The ultimate scary badass, is someone who is strong enough to rape, murder, and pillage at sheer will. Why hide when you have nothing to hide from because you're indeed the strongest. The fact that Itachi retreats means that he is conscious of his existence, therefore he is afraid to die. Someone who is afraid to die becomes weak. If you don't take chances because you are afraid of your own mortality, then you can never become the strongest. You just become a person who does what they can to survive. There is nothing scary or badass about that.

There is nothing scary about Itachi's mystery. I think you really meant "appealing," like in "What's appealing about Itachi is his mystery."

I disagree, one who retreats is careful, but it doesn't mean he's afraid to die. Just because you don't act like some dumbass doing dumb shit doesn't make you worthless. By taking these "Chances" which you say make a person strong, they also let their guard down and allow themselves to be defeated, itachi doesn't let that happen, his guard is not affected by personal desires. He is calculating, or atleast that's the impression -I- have of him.

(I'm no itachi fanboy, i'm just arguing hiten mitsurugi's point about him being weak because hes not taking chances etc) (^_^ )

[hiten mitsurugi]

Originally posted by: Uberbaka

I disagree, one who retreats is careful, but it doesn't mean he's afraid to die. Just because you don't act like some dumbass doing dumb shit doesn't make you worthless. By taking these "Chances" which you say make a person strong, they also let their guard down and allow themselves to be defeated, itachi doesn't let that happen, his guard is not affected by personal desires. He is calculating, or atleast that's the impression -I- have of him.

(I'm no itachi fanboy, i'm just arguing hiten mitsurugi's point about him being weak because hes not taking chances etc) (^_^ )

If you believe that strength is relative to just taking chances then you didn't get my point. A real bad-ass has no concious or fear. Just the thought of retreat means that they have regard for their life. Let me give you an examples.

If you fight someone who is known to retreat, then you can thwart his objectives by making him risk his life in return for completing his mission (i.e. make it so hard for him that he'll think twice). That's what happened to Itachi. Itachi could have easily tried to black flame (whatever it is) Jaraiya. But he didn't. Oh that's right, black flaming a wall and blackflaming a person, something that can move, are two different things.

Now if you fight someone who has no regard for life. You had better be ready to fight to the death because there isn't anything you can do to deter him or sway him. Now that is an ultimate badass and that's true fear. Regardless of how many men you have, or the type of weapons you're using. It's fight or die. Now those kind of badasses are the worst.

A great example would be Kyubi and the fourth. Kyubi has no regard for human life. He'll kill as many people as it takes. However the fourth was willing to step up to that challenge. Remember that kyubi is eternal. No other shinobi (from all villages) has ever stopped kyubi before. The fourth fought, willing to lose his life, in order to seal an eternal demon. Now that's an ultimate badass.

Now if you admire "calculated careful people" and think that's stupid then just imagine if the fourth had retreated like Itachi. Konoha villagers including many Uchihas, probably even Itachi, would have been killed.

[Neji-Aniki-sama]

[quote]
Originally posted by: hiten mitsurugi

Originally posted by: lasaire

That isn't true at all. The ultimate scary badass, is someone who is strong enough to rape, murder, and pillage at sheer will. Why hide when you have nothing to hide from because you're indeed the strongest. ."

True. That's why Gaara was the bad guy for me. Since I consider evil as absolute selfishness, Gaara was my man. I mourn his loss.
All other bad guys have their petty goals, like Oro's revenge against Konoha. That's not selfish, he was doing that because he hated the 3rd and love and hate are just two sides of the same attachement to a person or whatever.
Gaara did as he pleased. He didn't want to kill anybody in particular. So, he didn't have to waste his time plotting revenge or wanting to take over the world. His goal was to kill whomever he could, and that what he did. He was happy with himself, which means he had attained perfection as an evil guy. Being evil just for the sake of being evil...

[Death BOO Z]

Me not a Berserk fan? you've got to kidding...

{insert a really long speach about how ownish the anime was}

and also

{here comes a speach about how great the manga is}

and lets not forget that

{a speach about how 'real' the story and the charecters are}

and basically

Berserk is the best manga i've read so far.




after all that said and done, I'd like to point out that Berserk is an exceptional one of a kind anime, and that Naruto isn't following in it's footsteps.
Berserk doesn't represnt all action animes (I wish it did, though, that would mean we have a shitload of good manga to read), Inuyasha or Kenshin fit in more for the prototype of the genre...

you have to admit that in most action animes, the big and scary looking guys are usually cannon folder with visions of grandiouze...


About the Kisame-Zabuza topic, i wonder wheather they both become missing nins in the same incident, cuz if they did, it means that either Kisame is weaker than Zabuza or just incrediably stupid, since Zabuza was the one who planned the assisantaion and the coup' de' fout (something like that), so it's either that he was the strongest of them (and therefore the leader) or he was weaker but smarter (and therefore Kisame is an idiot), but since Kisame said that he was the strongest of the seven, it means he's not a thinking type, and he was just Zabuza's tool.

ofcouse, that all depends on wheather or not they become missing nins together...



oh, and speaking of Berserk, does anyone know what chapter is the begining of Volume 27? i've grown tired of waiting for the big 'tha hawks' realese, so i want to switch over to evilgenious and then replace it with the volume release in july...

can one of you guys help a depressed Berserk fan?